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Dancing with Herbert W. Options
stevelundgren
#1 Posted : Thursday, August 11, 2011 11:00:28 AM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 3/3/2008
Posts: 27,797

Questioning Herbert W. Armstrong



Was Herbert W. Armstrong who he said he was? Did he tell the truth?
These articles are for those who want to get to the bottom of these things.

Note: If this is the first time you have visited this page, you might want to
first read: Why is it Difficult For Exiters to Question Herbert Armstrong?

Put your faith completely in Jesus Christ,
not in any man or any movement.
~ Robert L. Sumner


- Questioning if HWA told the truth
- Questioning HWA's fruits
- Questioning HWA's background
- Questioning HWA's methods
- Questioning HWA's dogma


Questioning if HWA told the truth:


• Mystery of the Ages (a critical review)
Chapter by chapter in-depth review by Kelly Marshall; reveals not only
Herbert Armstrong's twisted and unscriptural gospel, but shows his recruitment strategies,
outright lies, deceptions, contradictions and plagiarisms from other groups.

• Mystery of the Ages (a 2nd critical Review)
Chapter by chapter review by William Hohmann; reveals Herbert Armstrong's
sleight of hand of religious misinterpretation and how he caused readers to rely on his
teachings with the results being a false gospel that diminishes Christ.

• True Original Church/Faith Once Delivered
(Proof Herbert Armstrong Lied About the "Lost" Church Century)
Was the history of the early church, in its first century of existence, "lost,"
or are there in existence today documents that we can examine? Shows HWA intentionally withheld information.
By Kelly Marshall.


• More proof showing how HWA failed to quote all of the words from an 1885 book,
and thereby making readers think that church history had been lost!
Exact quotes from the book by William Fitzgerald, furnished in Kelly Marshall's
critique of Mystery of the Ages, chapter 6.

• Did Herbert Armstrong Distort Historical Church Documents?
This article shows proof that he did. By Kelly Marshall.

• Did Herbert W. Armstrong Have God's Truth?

• Was Herbert W. Armstrong God's True Servant?

• Did Herbert Armstrong Set Dates?
Includes HWA quote saying there is "no prophet today."

• Did Herbert Armstrong Say God Revealed the "Key to Unlocking Prophecy" to Him Alone?

• John Kiesz Furnishes Information on Herbert W. Armstrong
Kiesz was an elder in the Church of God Seventh Day and a close friend of HWA's;
includes a number of HWA's failed prophecies.


Questioning HWA's fruits

• "None of God's Servants Were Perfect" (for those who like to use this reasoning)

• Herbert W. Armstrong and the Incest

• Letter About Herbert Armstrong and the Incest
Sent to "Dear Friends in the Worldwide Church of God"

• Worldwide Church of God History
Transcription of message by Ken Westby message reveals how HWA treated those that
dared asked questions and confront the abuses; shows double standards of the Armstrongs

• Why Herbert W. Armstrong Couldn't Have Been God's True Apostle

• Robert Gerringer 1975 Letter to Charles Hunting
Reveals how Herbert Armstrong was confronted time and again with doctrinal issues and
failed to change. Covers double standards, false prophecies, bad fruit, lack of
intellectual freedom of the members to think for themselves, etc.

• Jack Kessler 1981 Letter to Worldwide Church of God Board of Directors
Reveals the evil of the continuing, persistent financial abuses in HWA's
Worldwide Church of God and the shocking moral depravity.


Questioning HWA's background

• Background exposé on HWA's early activities
Revealing info.

• HWA's early racist activities

• HWA studied communism

• Radio Church of God openly embraced the agenda of the American Communist Party
This also includes info about "Communism and the Churches."

• Herbert Armstrong Used Mein Kampf as a Guide in Controlling People

• HWA's questionable activities in international governmental affairs

• The Private Letters of Herbert W. Armstrong and Loma D. Armstrong
HWA and his wife were very active in international governmental affairs
following the United Nations' first meeting held in San Francisco in 1945.

• The Conspiracy Was Strong - The Discernment Ministries
Herbert W. Armstrong is mentioned in Parts 1-3 of this in-depth report--search for
the words "Worldwide Church of God; also mentions the FBI files on
Herbert Armstrong and Stanley Rader; covers Anthony Buzzard. [offsite link]

• Letter Regarding FBI Files on the Worldwide Church of God


Questioning HWA's methods

• How Did Herbert W. Armstrong Recruit People?
The step-by-step process.

• Did Herbert W. Armstrong Abuse His Flock?
Includes additional: How Did the Worldwide Church of God Abuse its Members?

• Dropouts See Hucksterism Where They Once Saw God
Newspaper article.

• Did Herbert W. Armstrong Change Words of Sacred Hymns?

• Lifton's Eight Criteria of Mind Control
Includes how it has been used by Herbert Armstrong and authoritarian offshoots.


Questioning HWA's dogma

Note: Exiters have had the Bible used on them in order to control, coerce,
exploit and manipulate them. In many cases the Scriptures were taken out of context and twisted.
Sorting through one's personal beliefs after exiting a high demand group takes much time.
The following information is listed for those who have expressed an interest in these subjects,
along with being a good study for those who insist we must keep the Law.

• Two critical reviews of Mystery of the Ages (linked above)

• Herbert W. Armstrong's Religious Roots
The origin of Herbert's unique doctrines.

• What Were the Lies and What is the Truth?
Replacing HWA's fear-based statements with the truth from the Word of God.

• Where Do I Find the "One True Church"?

• The Law of Moses and the Grace of God
Excellent article.

• Must We Keep the Law for Salvation?
Answers many scriptural questions.

• Are We Still Under the Law in Spite of Grace?
Includes at bottom: "Aren't works necessary for salvation?"

• Why Church Leaders Demand Holy Days For Their Members
Could it have anything to do with control?

• Should the Sabbath be Observed Today?
Excellent study.

• Sabbath and Sunday (Common Arguments and Misunderstandings)

• Discernment of Truth and Deceptions
Examining Sabbatarian theology.

• Thirty-Six Pro Sabbath Arguments Examined

• Sabbath Not A Law For Christians [offsite link]
Answers many arguments Sabbath keepers make.

• Lying for God (Fighting Dirty In Defense Of The Three Pillars of Adventism) [offsite link]

• A Critique of Which Day is the Christian Sabbath?
Critique of HWA's Sabbath booklet.

• Did Jeroboam Change the Sabbath to Sunday?

• Tithing and Sheep in Wolves Clothing
Who really is changing times and laws?

• We Put the "Give Way" to the Test
Is it true that you can't out-give God?

• Third Tithe - Where Did it Really Go?

• Tithing?
Brief, but good article on tithing vs. Spirit-directed giving. [offsite link]

• Should the Church Teach Tithing? (reasons to replace tithing)
Online book; click on chapter titles on left [offsite link]

• "Bible Correspondence Course" (an Examination)
Are you able to realize the things unproven and unsupported by Scripture that have been
slipped into your Bible Correspondence Course? Includes questions to help you find out.

• British-Israelism--True or False?

• Where Are the Tribes of Israel Located? (A Critique of Herman Hoeh's Article)
Shows incredible fabrications and lack of concrete, detailed proof.

• The Origins of Assyria and Germany
This article shows the fallacy in HWA's teaching that the Assyrians "settled in central Europe,
and the Germans are the descendants of the ancient Assyrians."

• How is the Term Israel Used in the New Testament?
Shows how the church is not "spiritual Israel" ) (also covers Gal 6:16. [offsite link]

• A Comparison and Contrast Between Israel and the Church [offsite link]

• A Critique of "You Are Saved by Grace!"
Critique of Stephen Flurry's booklet.

• The Sin Question
Explains what "dead to sin" and "dead to the Law" really mean.

• Let Go of Days, Take Hold of Christ
Is it necessary to observe holy days and rituals in order to gain eternal life?

• What About the Seal of God and the Mark of the Beast?
Shows that this teaching originally came from the Seventh-day Adventists. [offsite link]

• Unclean Meats Not a Law For Christians
This command is found only in the Mosaic Law. [offsite link]

• Do We Only Receive the Holy Spirit As a Result of Baptism?
Do we receive God's Spirit as a result of faith, or faith plus baptism?
How do we receive the Holy Spirit and what does the Holy Spirit do in the believer's life today?

• Is the Holy Spirit Only the Power of God?
Also lists the Scriptures showing the two natures of Jesus--God/Man.

• "The Resurrection Was Not on Sunday" (A look at Herbert W. Armstrong's Booklet)

• Any Good Doctrine in the Herbert Armstrong Era?

• Doctrines of Devils - Did Herbert Armstrong teach them?

• Did Christ Reorganize the Church?
1939 article from the February 1939 Good News showing HWA condemned
hierarchal church government in his early years. [offsite article]


"Thou maketh this people to trust in a lie." ~ Jeremiah 28:15



Source Link

Those people are zealous to win you over,
but for no good. What they want is to alienate you from us,
so that you may have zeal for them. - Galatians 4:17
Sponsor  
 
stevelundgren
#2 Posted : Friday, August 12, 2011 7:43:24 AM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 3/3/2008
Posts: 27,797

Mystery of the Ages (a critical review)

By Kelly Marshall

There are probably few people in the world that haven't contemplated life's deepest questions.
Herbert Armstrong claimed his book Mystery of the Ages answered those questions and that these
mysteries were divinely revealed to him by God.

Can you know for sure these things are true? Does this book stand up to the truth of Scripture?
Or is it merely black and white answers to life that come with a high price?

This review, which is based on the 1985 hardback version, will go through each chapter and
confront these "mysteries." Its purpose will be to:
1. Help those who come into contact with this book to understand the true agenda behind it;
2. Show how HWA substituted the true gospel of Jesus Christ with a false gospel;
3. Help those who have exited from these groups to understand how they were snared and help them
untangle themselves from the lies, and
4. Prove that HWA was a false prophet, liar and deceiver.

[Update: Gerald Flurry of Philadelphia Church of God (PCG) deleted and changed portions of this book.
Read: April 13, 2004 letter to ESN.]


By Kelly Marshall

More from Source

Those people are zealous to win you over,
but for no good. What they want is to alienate you from us,
so that you may have zeal for them. - Galatians 4:17
stevelundgren
#3 Posted : Saturday, August 13, 2011 4:57:17 AM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 3/3/2008
Posts: 27,797

Wow.

This is a well-written review of HWA's book, Mystery of the Ages.
Follow the link above.

I just completed reading the Preface and Introduction reviews.
If you want to understand Armstrongism, this is key information.

Those people are zealous to win you over,
but for no good. What they want is to alienate you from us,
so that you may have zeal for them. - Galatians 4:17
stevelundgren
#4 Posted : Sunday, August 14, 2011 7:54:50 AM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 3/3/2008
Posts: 27,797

I still have one chapter remaining to read on this.

Very well written, though admittedly quite long.

Worthwhile, if you want to be informed about the treachery of HWA.

Link to Mystery of the Ages (a critical review)


Those people are zealous to win you over,
but for no good. What they want is to alienate you from us,
so that you may have zeal for them. - Galatians 4:17
stevelundgren
#5 Posted : Sunday, August 14, 2011 7:56:21 PM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 3/3/2008
Posts: 27,797

Oops.

Chapter 6 has 5 parts and chapter 7 has 3 parts.

All very good, but an incredibly long read.

Just wanted to give fair warning.

Those people are zealous to win you over,
but for no good. What they want is to alienate you from us,
so that you may have zeal for them. - Galatians 4:17
stevelundgren
#6 Posted : Sunday, August 14, 2011 10:48:52 PM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 3/3/2008
Posts: 27,797

ADDENDUM

The opening post of this topic lists numerous articles about HWA.
I'm working my way through the first article.

I just have to say at this point.
Hubert W, Armstrong is the Adolf Hitler of 20th century religion.
His book, Mystery of the Ages is the Mein Kampf of the religious cults.

He did with full knowledge and malicious intent send countless souls to
eternal damnation for his own financial gain.

He purposely diverted attention away from the saving grace of Jesus Christ.
In its place he promoted the "government of God".
He placed himself at the top of human authority for the "Church of God".
In a top down hierarchy of dictatorship.
And taught that salvation was found through his church alone.
He also retained the right to "disfellowship" (damn) anyone that
was not in complete submission to his authoritative reign.

He enslaved church members and bleed them dry.
People died because of his teachings against the use of health care.
The far reaching results of his crimes against humanity continue to wreak havoc.

The splinter churches from the WCOG continue in his foot steps.
(excepting Grace Communion International)

It sickens me that the COG is using our forum to promote this hideous evil.

If you, or anyone you love has been affected by this group, I recommend this website.
It is a support, research and resource site which assists and supports exiters of
Worldwide Church of God, or any related controlling splinter group or offshoot,
and who have suffered spiritual, psychological and financial abuse and exploitation.

Help and Hope for Exiters of Worldwide Church of God and Offshoots


Those people are zealous to win you over,
but for no good. What they want is to alienate you from us,
so that you may have zeal for them. - Galatians 4:17
Intangible
#7 Posted : Monday, August 15, 2011 12:15:20 AM
Rank: Advanced Member



Joined: 1/4/2010
Posts: 9,924
Location: on a hill in the hollow
stevelundgren wrote:

ADDENDUM

He purposely diverted attention away from the saving grace of Jesus Christ.
In its place he promoted the "government of God".
He placed himself at the top of human authority for the "Church of God".
In a top down hierarchy of dictatorship.
And taught that salvation was found through his church alone.
He also retained the right to "disfellowship" (damn) anyone that
was not in complete submission to his authoritative reign.

He enslaved church members and bleed them dry.
People died because of his teachings against the use of health care.
The far reaching results of his crimes against humanity continue to wreak havoc.




This sounds like the founding of Jehovah's Witnesses, a top down system of complete submission to the Governing Body in every area of life. They also take a dim view of medicine, much more then just no blood transfusions. While now they do say it is a matter of your personal conscience what you do, they used to be more controlling.

I honestly can say they never seemed to actually seek money and make it your duty or else type situation. They are, for the most part, plain and straight forward when it comes to money and I never saw a ostentatious show of wealth amongst the members. Hours spent in the ministry was always a major driving force but not money.
It is inaccurate to say that I hate everything. I am strongly in favor of common sense, common honesty, and common decency. This makes me forever ineligible for public office.

H. L. Mencken



stevelundgren
#8 Posted : Monday, August 15, 2011 6:52:45 AM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 3/3/2008
Posts: 27,797
Intangible wrote:
This sounds like the founding of Jehovah's Witnesses, a top down system of complete submission to the Governing Body in every area of life. They also take a dim view of medicine, much more then just no blood transfusions. While now they do say it is a matter of your personal conscience what you do, they used to be more controlling.

I honestly can say they never seemed to actually seek money and make it your duty or else type situation. They are, for the most part, plain and straight forward when it comes to money and I never saw a ostentatious show of wealth amongst the members. Hours spent in the ministry was always a major driving force but not money.

Doctrinally, COG has some close similarities to JWs.

So many of these groups are related spiritually to Millerism.
I add the COG to LDS, SDA and JWs. COG more loosely. But it is there.

As you can see from my comments above. I was appalled at what I learned about HWA and his book, Mystery of the Ages.
Readers of that book were encouraged to send for his other book, The United States and Great Britain in Prophecy.

Does that sound familiar?



Those people are zealous to win you over,
but for no good. What they want is to alienate you from us,
so that you may have zeal for them. - Galatians 4:17
stevelundgren
#9 Posted : Monday, August 15, 2011 9:27:31 PM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 3/3/2008
Posts: 27,797

Here is one section of the book review that is well worth noting.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Mystery of the Ages (a critical review)

By Kelly Marshall

Chapter Six - Mystery of the Church (Pt. 4 of 5)


GRACE

Herbert Armstrong despised the doctrine of grace. On one hand, he taught that grace was
"unmerited pardon," but he emphasized endlessly the loaded term "grace was license to sin."
This kind of double talk produced a cognitive dissonance in the members, who never
questioned this disparity. He openly expresses indignation and continually impugns guilt
toward "traditional Christianity" for "nailing the law to the cross." So disdainful was HWA's
attitude toward this particular doctrine that the Subject Index at the end of the MOA has
the word grace listed twice and it is found on the same page:

He [Simon Magus] accepted the doctrine of "grace for the forgiveness of sin
(which the pagan religions never had), but turned grace into license to
disobey God (Jude 4). (p. 52)


Now this brings us to an interesting point. HWA tries to make the reader believe that
grace was nothing more than a license to sin. But in his own contrived "Plan of Salvation,"
he announces that the whole of mankind will not be judged for all the sins committed in this
present life—he will merely reap the consequences of what he sows. Listen closely to what
HWA is saying. "Sin all you want in this present life. God isn't judging you or condemning
you for anything you have done, no matter how evil, although you will have to reap the natural
consequences. When Satan is removed, then you will be resurrected in a beautiful paradise on
this earth, have your eyes opened and given a chance to qualify for your salvation. Only this time,
it will be a cakewalk since Satan won't be around to influence you to sin."19 Now whose plan of
salvation is giving license to sin? Although HWA accuses "traditional Christianity" for
teaching others to sin with impunity, we see just the opposite happening here. Careful examination
of this salvation plan makes one thing obvious: It is better that one not be part of the Church
in this present age. There are too many disadvantages. You have Satan and the world fighting against
you (in the next age he will be bound), and you can fall out of favor with the organization and
be condemned to eternal death in the Lake of Fire! Yes, what HWA doesn't reveal in the MOA,
is that one who leaves the church will lose his salvation. Once one has "tasted this way of life"
and turns his back on it, he is considered incorrigible and is condemned.20 Never mind that the
majority that "left" were forcefully put out and not allowed to return, but as observed earlier,
HWA is a master at leaving out important details when it plays to his disadvantage.
(Although HWA states on page 272 that one "put out of the church could be readmitted
upon repentance and renewed belief," members know this happens rarely.)

Why didn't HWA ever challenge his followers to look up the word "grace" in the Strong's Concordance?
He repeatedly guided his followers to the oft-quoted passage in Jude 4, but never mentioned the numerous
Scriptures found in the NT using the word grace (129 of them to be exact). Shouldn't we find this odd
coming from a man of God? Grace must have been very important to have been mentioned this many times
in the Bible. Why would HWA overlook this very fact? HWA doesn't want his readers to know about grace
because he cannot enslave those who fully understand the true meaning of grace.21 He minimized grace,
perverted its meaning, so his followers turn up their noses in disgust whenever this word is mentioned.

Source

Those people are zealous to win you over,
but for no good. What they want is to alienate you from us,
so that you may have zeal for them. - Galatians 4:17
stevelundgren
#10 Posted : Tuesday, August 16, 2011 9:37:14 PM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 3/3/2008
Posts: 27,797

Here's something to consider while I finish up reading the excessively long 13
web pages of the Mystery of Ages book review. It's as good as it is long.
I'm getting a real education in all things Herbert. (he's a monster - seriously)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Roots of the Worldwide Church of God


William Miller (1782-1849)
Predicted Christ would return in 1843 (date later changed to 1844). Gathered a large following.
He later went his own way after the prophecy failed. (Note: David Koresh's apocalyptic organization
broke off from the Millerites. Their indoctrination and doctrine was very similar to WCG's.


Joseph Bates (1792-1872)
Introduced observance of the Saturday Sabbath to the Millerites after reading an article
by Thomas M. Preble, who learned about it from Fredrick Wheeler, a Millerite preacher at the
time (early 1844) who accepted the Sabbath after a study which began as a challenge from
Rachel Oaks, a Seventh Day Baptist. Joseph Bates, with James Springer White,
is recognized as co-founder of the SDA denomination.


Ellen G. White (1827-1915)
Wife of James S. White. She accepted the 7th day Sabbath after reading and accepting
Joseph Bates' articles. Claimed to have been given "the gift of prophecy" around 1844 and
had visions and dreams of "Bible truths." Became the highest authority of the
7th Day Adventist Church. She plagiarized the same as HWA did.
(Read about Ellen White's Plagiarism) [offsite link]


Gilbert Cranmer (1814-1904)
Had originally followed William Miller. Accepted the Sabbath after hearing Joseph Bates.
Believed in the soon coming of Christ. Started Church of Christ, later known as Church of God,
Stanberry, Missouri, later known as the Church of God 7th Day. He taught that
the whole Law of Moses was never abolished and was to be observed.


G. G. Rupert (1847-1922)
Independent minister of Church of God 7th Day. Observed law of Moses.
Ascribed prophetic importance to the year 1933. Believed in time cycles.
Taught the Sabbath observing church of God was the only true Christian church
on earth by lineage. Published "Remnant of Israel," which Herbert W. Armstrong
plagiarized from. (Note: Herbert W. Armstrong plagiarized many of Rupert's writings
and this is documented in many places. See: Herbert W. Armstrong's Religious Roots.)


Andrew N. Dugger (1886-1975)
Son of Church of God 7th Day's first vice president, A. F. Dugger. He was a minister
of Church of God 7th Day since 1906 and president of the General Conference and editor of
the Bible Advocate. He believed he could raise up the continuation of "the primitive"
New Testament church. He and C. O. Dodd (who was a Jehovah's Witness) wrote, A True History
of a True Religion, which was later known to be deliberately falsified.
(Herman L. Hoeh of the WCG later wrote A True History of the True Church in 1959,
which was also shown to be falsified. (See: True Original Church/Faith Once Delivered
for proof that Herbert Armstrong lied about the "lost" church century.)
Dugger split from the Stanberry, MO church and established headquarters in Salem, WV in 1933.


Herbert W. Armstrong (1892-1986)
His wife Loma was influenced by Ora Runcorn of the Church of God 7th Day
(headquartered in Stanberry, MO) in 1926. Armstrong was ordained to the ministry of this
church in 1932, making the split with Andrew N. Dugger in 1933 to the Salem,
WV Church of God 7th Day, where he became one of the "Seventy Elders." He had his
ministerial license revoked in 1937 after trying to introduce his theory of British-Israelism
and holy days. Founded the Radio Church of God in 1934 (name was changed to
Worldwide Church of God in 1968*). He preached a version of Millerism and plagiarized the
writings of Seventh-day Adventists, Jehovah's Witnesses, Mormonism and Pentecostals
(the last three groups have occult roots).
(For more on the history of Herbert Armstrong see Worldwide Church of God.)

Source Link



Those people are zealous to win you over,
but for no good. What they want is to alienate you from us,
so that you may have zeal for them. - Galatians 4:17
stevelundgren
#11 Posted : Wednesday, August 17, 2011 5:04:48 PM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 3/3/2008
Posts: 27,797

Finally finished the review of Mystery of Ages. A very long read. (13 long scrolling web pages)
Very well written though. Very detailed. I learned a lot.

Here is the closing statements for those that just want the bottomline.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

HWA is guilty of false teaching. Those who put their trust in the Lord must avoid false teachers.
Over and over again, in the MOA, we have seen false teaching after false teaching. HWA epitomizes
1 Timothy 6:3-5. He was known to be very proud and extravagant, disguising this as, "God loves Quality."
Throughout the entire MOA, we have seen him stir up strife with divisive accusations against
Biblical Christianity. We certainly see little of the actual words of Christ used in the MOA,
leaving out the wholesome words of our Savior. All of this is done for one specific purpose,
as Scripture astutely observes: financial gain.

May the reader listen to Paul, and do so accordingly. May the Spirit lead those who have read
this review to "withdraw from such" and seek the love, goodness, kindness and gentleness of
the Lord Jesus Christ. He is waiting with open arms and gives rest to all who come to Him:

Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart:
and ye shall find rest unto your souls. For my yoke is easy,
and my burden is light." (Matt. 11:28-30)

By Kelly Marshall (former WCG member)
Exit & Support Network™
August 2006

Article Link

Those people are zealous to win you over,
but for no good. What they want is to alienate you from us,
so that you may have zeal for them. - Galatians 4:17
stevelundgren
#12 Posted : Wednesday, August 17, 2011 6:48:26 PM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 3/3/2008
Posts: 27,797

True Original Church/Faith Once Delivered
(Proof Herbert Armstrong Lied About the "Lost" Church Century)



By Kelly Marshall

Herbert W. Armstrong claimed in Mystery of the Ages that "The true Church of God was
to be set back on track, restoring the glorious knowledge of the faith once delivered to
the saints in the days of the original apostles." (p. 139, 140) Let's take him up on
that claim. Let's examine what this "faith once delivered" is. HWA made his followers
believe that early church history was vague—"as if obscured by a thick mist." (p. 280).
He claims that the curtain begins to lift around A.D. 150, but now this "original church"
is "a totally different church," but called itself Christian. Is this really true? Or does
"God’s Apostle" not want us to go snooping around and find anything that may oppose his
teachings? HWA made his followers believe that historical records were tainted at worst,
and scanty or non-existent at best. He assures us, "I have often called it 'the lost century,'
because the history of that Church was lost at that time." (p. 280) Really? Was the history
of the early church, in its first century of existence, "lost," or are there any records that
are in existence today that we can examine? Yes, indeed, there are, and I guarantee
that HWA was fully aware of them, and intentionally withheld this knowledge!

The church writings of the first century were produced by the "Apostolic Fathers."1
This simply means that the men who produced these historical manuscripts were taught
directly by an apostle. (Irenaeus is the only exception, but he was a disciple of
Polycarp since boyhood, while the Apostle John was still living. Irenaeus and Justin Martyr
are considered the "sub-apostolic" fathers since their writings branch from the
first century and into the second century of the early church. The writings of the
Apostolic and sub-apostolic fathers span from 30 A.D. to 202 A.D. Halley's Bible Handbook,
in referring to these writings, says "they are extremely valuable, as they form the
connecting link between the Apostles and later Church history. Some of them were
so highly regarded that, in some localities, they were temporarily regarded as Scripture."2

When one ventures into reading the early apostolic writings, he will begin to notice several things:

1. Emphasis that Jesus is the Savior and the importance of belief in Him; those who believe are saved,
those who don’t are condemned
2. The reality and hope of the Resurrection
3. The lack of any instructions about Sabbath-keeping, Holy Day observance, O.T. law-keeping, and tithing
4. The condemnation of law-keeping and Judaizing
5. That the Commandments of God and Christ are performing works of love—helping the poor, widows,
and orphans; wives showing love toward their husbands and being instructed in their marriages; ending strife
and conflict in the body; staying faithful to the church; abstaining from and putting away all forms of evil
6. Weekly Sunday worship by the authority of the Sunday Resurrection
7. That man has an immortal soul
8. Believers, after Christ's resurrection, went to heaven
9. Nothing concerning the significance of the lost Ten Tribes and identity of Israel
10. Nothing about Lucifer and one-third of the angels losing their opportunity of "carrying out a
tremendous creative program throughout the entire universe" and this opportunity defaulting
to man because of their rebellion

Volume 1 of the Ante-Nicene Fathers contains the writings of Clement of Rome, Mathetes, Polycarp,
Ignatius, Barnabas, Papias, Justin Martyr and Irenaeus. We will begin by showing that these men
received their teachings directly from an apostle, and we will prove that they did not stray from
the "original" teachings, as HWA would like his readers to believe. We will prove that HWA is
guilty of "suppressing the truth" by making his readers believe that little was said during
the first century of the early church, and we will prove that this early church did not
emerge around 150 A.D. as a "false" Christian church.

One must keep in mind that many of these Epistles were written while the authors were condemned
to death. Knowing their lives were ending shortly, it would stand to reason that they would transmit
the most important details of the gospel to their followers. (I invite the reader to read these
testimonies online, in their fullness. They are very inspirational.) One will quickly discover
that the central message is about Jesus—His life, death, and resurrection—and these men and women
were willing to die for that testimony. Let's begin with our first apostolic father, Clement of Rome.

Historians recorded that Clement had learned directly from Paul (A.D. 66) and Luke, and that
John (A.D. 98) was still alive during the writing of Clement's Epistle to the Corinthians (A.D. 95).
Clement lived between 30-100 A.D., clearly proving that the original apostles were still living
during the time of Clement, since Paul was not martyred until about A.D. 67, and
John’s death occurred about A.D. 98.

The First Epistle to the Corinthians is long, and I have excerpted the modern historians'
comments to show the reader that this epistle falls before HWA's "tainted date" of 150 A.D.
Therefore, we can safely assume that Clement's writings did not contain any "error."

Link to the Rest of the Article

Those people are zealous to win you over,
but for no good. What they want is to alienate you from us,
so that you may have zeal for them. - Galatians 4:17
stevelundgren
#13 Posted : Wednesday, August 17, 2011 9:14:50 PM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 3/3/2008
Posts: 27,797

ADDENDUM to the above post.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Now let's review what the primitive church taught in the first century:

1. That Jesus was the Christ, born of a virgin, was crucified on Friday and bodily
resurrected to life on Sunday.
2. They met for weekly worship on Sunday.
3. They took up a collection for the poor and needy, but did not require tithing,
or giving of holy day offerings.
4. They taught that one must believe in Jesus to be saved, and those who don’t
believe in Him are condemned.
5. They believed that man has an immortal soul and believers have an eternal,
heavenly reward upon death.
6. Belief in the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.
7. They did not keep the O.T. Laws, the Sabbath, or the Holy Days, clean and
unclean meats, and circumcision; they condemned Judaizing.

Now let’s look at HWA's doctrines, 1900 years later:

1. Jesus was the Christ, born of a virgin; was crucified on Wednesday and bodily
resurrected to life on Saturday.
2. Saturday is the required day for worship. Sunday worship is the Mark of the Beast.
3. Required tithing, giving of holy day offerings and other monies to be sent to a
centralized "headquarters." Refusal to do so made one a Commandment breaker for
stealing from God, jeopardizing one’s salvation.
4. Taught that one must believe in the gospel of Jesus—His Kingdom message; those who don’t
believe in His "end time message" aren't condemned to eternal punishment, but will get a
second chance in the 2nd resurrection (although HWA called it their "first chance" ).
5. Man is a mortal soul and believers do not have a heavenly reward after death.
6. Belief in the Father, the Son, but the Holy Spirit is merely the power force of God.
7. Keeping the O.T. Laws, the Sabbath, or the Holy Days, clean and unclean meats, and
submission to "the government" as requirements for salvation.

Comparing the above lists, one can correctly deduce that HWA did not restore any
doctrines of the ""original" true church, but most importantly one can see that the
traditional Christian churches of today are in full agreement with the primitive church!
This is exactly what HWA was hiding!

In conclusion, we have proven that early church records do indeed exist, even though HWA
tried to make his readers believe otherwise. The records covered in this article span from
the time that the original apostles were still living and into the second century of the church.
The third century or the time leading up to the Council of Nicea was not covered, since we are
only interested in proving HWA's claim that a "curtain descended on the early church" to be false.
We have shown that these records are authentic, and are in harmony with one another, and with
the mainstream church today. Most importantly, they do not reflect any of the "truths" that
HWA claimed to "restore." HWA knew this but chose to mislead his readers anyway.

HWA specifically targeted those who were weak in Scripture because he knew they would be weak
in church history. HWA created an image of being knowledgeable and zealous—burning the midnight oil,
ingesting endless volumes of religious materials, while God personally guided him to discern "truth"
from error. He painted these respectable images in our minds—that he would stop at nothing to bring
us these nuggets of truth. So when HWA said that there was a "lost century" of the early church,
and that it metamorphosed into a false church, we readily believed him.

Source

Those people are zealous to win you over,
but for no good. What they want is to alienate you from us,
so that you may have zeal for them. - Galatians 4:17
stevelundgren
#14 Posted : Friday, August 19, 2011 7:11:34 AM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 3/3/2008
Posts: 27,797

Did Herbert W. Armstrong
Distort Historical Church Documents?


Did Herbert Armstrong take words out of context from
historical church documents, slanting, misquoting and distorting history
in order to try and prove he taught the true gospel?
Let us examine the facts.

- The Gnostic Heresy

- The Heresy of Judaism and the Roman Persecution

- The Quartodeciman Controversy

- The Nicene Council Concerning Easter


Articles at Source

Those people are zealous to win you over,
but for no good. What they want is to alienate you from us,
so that you may have zeal for them. - Galatians 4:17
stevelundgren
#15 Posted : Sunday, August 21, 2011 8:02:38 AM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 3/3/2008
Posts: 27,797

Did Herbert W. Armstrong Have God's Truth?

Herbert Armstrong claimed to have certain truths which
were revealed to him by God alone.


He said this knowledge had been lost for 1900 years but was now, in this end time, being proclaimed to
the world by God's "Apostle" (him) and through His "one and only true Church of God." Was this true? Or do his
doctrines, instead, appear to be very similar to other groups which have always claimed similar "truths"?
If one examines, for example, the doctrines of Jehovah's Witnesses, Mormonism, and Seventh-day Adventists,
and then compares what they teach with HWA's "truths," they will notice not only a similarity--
but in many cases a word for word copying
.1

It is well known that most leaders of Bible-based cults have been guilty of plagiarizing others'
material and then claiming it as their own--in other words, what God revealed specifically to them alone.
Plagiarizing is the act of copying the words or ideas of another author without giving that person recognition.
Herbert Armstrong's copying doctrines and then pawning it off to members as his own unique truth; i.e.,
"God's truth," would constitute plagiarizing. We all know that he never said, "I got this truth (or mystery)
from such and such author, but decided it was so good that I thought I would put it in a booklet of my own
and pass it on to all of you as the restored gospel." HWA was dishonest, since he always claimed
God had revealed that "truth" directly to him
...


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Many of Herbert Armstrong's "truths" sound quite similar to extremist New Age thinking and doctrine.
Compare what WCG members were taught to look forward to and what many New Agers and occultists
are looking forward to:

HWA TEACHINGS: (See comparitive List at Article Source)

NEW AGE/OCCULTIC TEACHINGS: (See comparitive List at Article Source)

More at Article Source

Those people are zealous to win you over,
but for no good. What they want is to alienate you from us,
so that you may have zeal for them. - Galatians 4:17
stevelundgren
#16 Posted : Monday, August 22, 2011 1:03:38 PM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 3/3/2008
Posts: 27,797

Was Herbert W. Armstrong God's True Servant?

Public criticism concerning HWA began circulating many years before he died.
To mention a few:


Dr. Walter Martin exposed Herbert Armstrong and the Worldwide Church of God in 1965
in The Kingdom of the Cults1; S. E. Anderson wrote Armstrongism's 300 Errors Exposed
(by 1300 Bible Verses) in 1973 as a result of long and concentrated study of the group's material;
Joseph Hopkins wrote The Armstrong Empire (A look at the Worldwide Church of God) in 1974;
Dr. Robert L. Sumner wrote Armstrongism: The "Worldwide Church of God" Examined in the
Searching Light of Scripture in 1974; The Ambassador Report2 started exposing the Armstrongs
and Worldwide Church of God in 1975; Marion J. McNair, a former WCG member and employee,
wrote Armstrongism: Religion or Rip-Off? (An Exposé of the Armstrong Modus Operandi) in 1977;
William B. Hinson, a former WCG minister, wrote The Broadway to Armageddon in 1977;
David Robinson, a former WCG minister and employee in many capacities, wrote
Herbert Armstrong's Tangled Web in 1980; Paul N. Benware analyzed the history and
teachings of the WCG in Ambassadors of Armstrongism in 1984; various newspaper articles
were written and subsequently archived by counter-cult organizations; certain
WCG exiters worked tirelessly distributing public flyers on HWA, the Worldwide Church of God
and The Plain Truth; and other exposé books and articles3 were written exposing Herbert Armstrong
while he was alive. (See our Booklist for titles and also how we offer three of these books in PDF.)

All this was in addition to both secular cult watching organizations and Orthodox Christian
ministries that were attempting to make the public aware of Herbert Armstrong and his "church."
The fact that almost all members were unaware of this material shows how effective the information
control of the WCG was. Since the mass exodus from the WCG began taking place after WCG's new
doctrinal changes were given to the members in 1995, easier access to computers and the internet have
enabled even more people (especially exiters) to come forth and criticize Herbert Armstrong and the WCG.

Today Herbert Armstrong lives on in hundreds of offshoots and splinter groups, most of which continue
to believe that he was a "true servant of God," "God's End-Time Man," or the "end-time Elijah" who
"restored the true gospel," a.k.a. the "Truth." ...

Link to More at Source

Those people are zealous to win you over,
but for no good. What they want is to alienate you from us,
so that you may have zeal for them. - Galatians 4:17
stevelundgren
#17 Posted : Monday, August 22, 2011 7:32:25 PM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 3/3/2008
Posts: 27,797

From article above.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Did Herbert Armstrong confess his sins before he died?

Herbert Armstrong left no written record or reliable witnessed testimony that he ever repented.
He was said to have been sitting in a chair, listening to the AC music tapes when he died.
(Read letter from former member who questioned HWA's death diagnosis.) He had plenty of time
to repent as his failing health continued for some time. In fact, he was supposed to have
appointed his successor nine days before he died, written a letter to the members one week
before he died, made out a will four days before he died, gave instructions for his jet
and Big Sandy College to be sold and his Autobiography Vol. 1 to be reprinted and Vol. 2
printed, plus he was able to play the piano almost to the end. Nothing mentioned of
"confessing his sins." For the last ten years of his life many who were close to
HWA wrote letters to him, pleading with him to start living the way of life
he had preached for decades and to reconcile with his son, Garner Ted.

There is no record, or evidence, that he ever admitted he did anything wrong; likewise that
he ever confessed to living a double standard, destroyed a massive number of lives and wasted
thousands of dollars (from those who sincerely thought he was the head of God's "one true church" )
by living in luxury and opulence. Is this how a person who has repented will behave?
(For a stark contrast of how a true servant of God will conduct his personal life and his
work for God, read the book: George Muller of Bristol by A. T. Pierson.)

But let us ask a question: Did Herbert Armstrong even know the true God, or want to know Him?
If so, why was he not sensitive all those many years to the Holy Spirit who convicts us of our sins?
A "death-bed repentance" has often been the excuse of those who want to justify someone as being
"commissioned and led by God." In HWA's case, there is no evidence there was even a death-bed
repentance, or any kind of repentance. But if HWA ever repented, he would have had to come to
God through Jesus Christ as His Savior, which is the only way he could have come. HWA,
as we know, was ashamed of the name of Jesus, not only failing to mention it to dignitaries
that he visited in foreign countries, but leaving out songs in WCG's hymnbook about Jesus.

The Bible is clear that Christians are to teach the whole Word of God, which centers around
the death, burial and resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ and his free gift of eternal life.
Instead, HWA ridiculed and slandered other Christian ministers (calling them counterfeit).
He did not teach that we can receive eternal life now by turning to Jesus Christ as our Savior
and placing our faith in Him, instead of membership in what he called "God's true church" and
in doing various works. Instead, he made the unscriptural statement that we are "not called
just for salvation," but for "a special training provided only in God's Church."
(Mystery of the Ages, p. 270-271)

Those people are zealous to win you over,
but for no good. What they want is to alienate you from us,
so that you may have zeal for them. - Galatians 4:17
sarge
#18 Posted : Monday, August 22, 2011 8:08:38 PM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 9/9/2008
Posts: 3,698
Steve wrote:
Instead, HWA ridiculed and slandered other Christian ministers (calling them counterfeit).
He did not teach that we can receive eternal life now by turning to Jesus Christ as our Savior
and placing our faith in Him, instead of membership in what he called "God's true church" and
in doing various works. Instead, he made the unscriptural statement that we are "not called
just for salvation," but for "a special training provided only in God's Church."
(Mystery of the Ages, p. 270-271)


So true Steve and sad to say the COG is still teaching these unscriptural principles to this very day.

The division they continue to promote amongst Christians is at an all time high. It's extremely unfortunate.



Sarge
~ Insults Should Be Written In Sand ~ Compliments Should Be Carved In Stone ~

stevelundgren
#19 Posted : Monday, August 22, 2011 9:11:08 PM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 3/3/2008
Posts: 27,797
sarge wrote:
Steve wrote:
Instead, HWA ridiculed and slandered other Christian ministers (calling them counterfeit).
He did not teach that we can receive eternal life now by turning to Jesus Christ as our Savior
and placing our faith in Him, instead of membership in what he called "God's true church" and
in doing various works. Instead, he made the unscriptural statement that we are "not called
just for salvation," but for "a special training provided only in God's Church."
(Mystery of the Ages, p. 270-271)


So true Steve and sad to say the COG is still teaching these unscriptural principles to this very day.

The division they continue to promote amongst Christians is at an all time high. It's extremely unfortunate.

Sarge

Yup.

Here's more from the same article. Note the text in dark red.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

But wasn't Herbert Armstrong sincere, even though he wasn't perfect?

For someone not to care about the thousands of people they were exploiting, the numerous families
they caused to be torn apart, the fears and guilt they were injected into innocent minds, turning a
deaf ear to others' pleas, and knowing the hypocrisy of their own life has got to be the absolute
depth of evil. HWA may have said, "follow me as I follow Christ," but the reality was, he did not
follow Christ (nor "imitate" Christ, which is what the Greek word for "follow" means in II Thes. 3:7, 9).
Anyone who proclaims that Herbert Armstrong was "a sincere Christian," or "dedicated to Christ"
when they know otherwise is having a part in that evil. These words are hard to hear
but we cannot continue to hold onto a myth.

"None of God's Servants Were Perfect" (for those who like to use this reasoning)

Notice David Robinson's words:

"The truth is that this man is so profligate, so practiced a liar, so evil that he can only
be a direct servant of Satan the devil. He operates in the name of God to serve his own wicked self,
just as he took his own teenage daughter and abused her for 10 years, in the name of God!
Many of his ministers know this and privately say so. He has brought great shame
on the name of God and on true religions."
(excerpted from 1981 letter Robinson wrote; published in Ambassador Report #17)

William B. Hinson, a former WCG minister, had this to say:

"Herbert W. Armstrong has destroyed more lives than anyone I know in the name of religion in
such a short period of time. The Armstrong work is a work of darkness and Christians are called
upon to reveal the work of darkness." (The Broadway to Armageddon, chapter 1, p. 10)


It is hard for many to admit that Herbert Armstrong was a fraud who used religion as a racket.
Many have written about his sins, his false prophecies and intentional deceptions, and his false gospel.


Those people are zealous to win you over,
but for no good. What they want is to alienate you from us,
so that you may have zeal for them. - Galatians 4:17
stevelundgren
#20 Posted : Wednesday, August 24, 2011 7:11:56 AM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 3/3/2008
Posts: 27,797

Did Herbert Armstrong Set Dates?

In reading HWA's literature we can see that he gave constant reference to the
"next 5-10-15-20 years." While authoritarian splinter groups of the Worldwide Church of God,
such as Philadelphia Church of God, may be more careful today in setting dates, they still
tell members that the "time is short," "the end is near," "we're in the gun lap," or even
"we may have only 2 to 3 years left" (which is repeated every few years by PCG).

Between early 1938 and mid 1945 Herbert Armstrong had given 21 major prophecy failures.1
By the time he died, he had given over 200 false prophecies! Are we still waiting
for them to be fulfilled?2

After 1972 arrived--when WCG members were supposed to flee and when the Great Tribulation
was to begin--many were surprised that they were still there. But ministers excused it all
away by saying "the church was not ready; the spots are not all out." Later on members were
told HWA "never set dates" and that "members took things in their own hands"
(to sell their homes, purchase passports, etc.) and they should destroy the original
1975 in Prophecy booklet. This type of programming effectively covers over what HWA actually said.
Also read: Memories About Petra which shows HWA would resort to justifying his prophecies
whenever they didn't come to pass.

Link to Article at Source

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Quote from article above:

Many deceived followers of certain of the controlling WCG offshoots,
such as Philadelphia Church of God, Restored Church of God, and Living Church of God
are walking down the same pathway today.


Note: The Living Church of God is promoted on this Forum. Beware!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Additional Related Article:

Herbert W. Armstrong's 209 False Prophecies
The Most Comprehensive Listing of Herbert Armstrong's
52 year record of False Prophesies ever made.

Additional Article Link

Those people are zealous to win you over,
but for no good. What they want is to alienate you from us,
so that you may have zeal for them. - Galatians 4:17
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