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Intangible
#21 Posted : Sunday, May 27, 2018 7:59:34 PM
Rank: Advanced Member



Joined: 1/4/2010
Posts: 10,646
Location: on a hill in the hollow
The difference between patriotism and nationalism is that the patriot is proud of his country for what it does, and the nationalist is proud of his country no matter what it does; the first attitude creates a feeling of responsibility, but the second a feeling of blind arrogance that leads to war.
Sydney J. Harris
Intangible
#22 Posted : Wednesday, June 6, 2018 10:45:11 PM
Rank: Advanced Member



Joined: 1/4/2010
Posts: 10,646
Location: on a hill in the hollow
The difference between patriotism and nationalism is that the patriot is proud of his country for what it does, and the nationalist is proud of his country no matter what it does; the first attitude creates a feeling of responsibility, but the second a feeling of blind arrogance that leads to war.
Sydney J. Harris
Intangible
#23 Posted : Thursday, June 7, 2018 7:28:59 PM
Rank: Advanced Member



Joined: 1/4/2010
Posts: 10,646
Location: on a hill in the hollow
Hitler vs Trump

The difference between patriotism and nationalism is that the patriot is proud of his country for what it does, and the nationalist is proud of his country no matter what it does; the first attitude creates a feeling of responsibility, but the second a feeling of blind arrogance that leads to war.
Sydney J. Harris
Intangible
#24 Posted : Thursday, June 14, 2018 9:53:08 PM
Rank: Advanced Member



Joined: 1/4/2010
Posts: 10,646
Location: on a hill in the hollow
Echos of 1942...

The difference between patriotism and nationalism is that the patriot is proud of his country for what it does, and the nationalist is proud of his country no matter what it does; the first attitude creates a feeling of responsibility, but the second a feeling of blind arrogance that leads to war.
Sydney J. Harris
stevelundgren
#25 Posted : Friday, June 15, 2018 6:35:38 AM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 3/3/2008
Posts: 27,825

Here we go again.
They complain about children in "cages" like animals.
So we move them out of "cages" into tent cities
and now they scream "Nazi concentration camps".
There is no pleasing these tyrants.
Make up your minds!

Intangible wrote:
Echos of 1942...


Those people are zealous to win you over,
but for no good. What they want is to alienate you from us,
so that you may have zeal for them. - Galatians 4:17
Intangible
#26 Posted : Friday, June 15, 2018 4:52:38 PM
Rank: Advanced Member



Joined: 1/4/2010
Posts: 10,646
Location: on a hill in the hollow
You are pathetic! You have actually owned this inhumane treatment of immigrants by claiming "we move them out of "cages" into tent cities". You fully support this action!

Wake up, this is even worse than we did to the Japanese Americans in 1942!

It isn't the size of the "cage" that matters, whether kept ten in a 20 foot cage or 5,000 kept in barbed wire, NO person in this nation should be "caged" without due process of the law. You worry about Nazis free speech, but these kids and their families you think should be "caged"!

As a rule of thumb, if you have a flock of chickens that will be kept housed indoors, they require at least ten square feet per bird. How many square feet should a caged human be allotted?



Japanese American Relocation 1942-1945

Japanese internment camps were established during World War II by President Franklin Roosevelt through his Executive Order 9066. From 1942 to 1945, it was the policy of the U.S. government that people of Japanese descent would be interred in isolated camps. Enacted in reaction to Pearl Harbor and the ensuing war, the Japanese internment camps are now considered one of the most atrocious violations of American civil rights in the 20th century.

At least when we interned the Japanese Americans, we kept the family unit intact. Under Sessions's policy, kids are separated from their parents with the parents themselves being split by sex. Then of course they segregate sibling by sex and age group meaning the entire family unit is broken down. This violates all standards of human rights.

If nothing else, think of the funds required to house all of these people in separate internment camps scattered around the nation. If they want to put them into tent cities as a family unit, it would save redundant costs for housing males and females separate and then separated by age. Children should not be punished for the actions of their parents.



stevelundgren wrote:

Here we go again.
They complain about children in "cages" like animals.
So we move them out of "cages" into tent cities
and now they scream "Nazi concentration camps".
There is no pleasing these tyrants.
Make up your minds!

Intangible wrote:
Echos of 1942...



The difference between patriotism and nationalism is that the patriot is proud of his country for what it does, and the nationalist is proud of his country no matter what it does; the first attitude creates a feeling of responsibility, but the second a feeling of blind arrogance that leads to war.
Sydney J. Harris
stevelundgren
#27 Posted : Friday, June 15, 2018 5:22:24 PM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 3/3/2008
Posts: 27,825

So you are claiming that you prefer to leave children in cages? (because that's better)
And you call me pathetic?

Make up your mind.

Without due process of the law?
Are you claiming they are here legally?

Intangible wrote:
You are pathetic! You have actually owned this inhumane treatment of immigrants by claiming "we move them out of "cages" into tent cities". You fully support this action!

Wake up, this is even worse than we did to the Japanese Americans in 1942!

It isn't the size of the "cage" that matters, whether kept ten in a 20 foot cage or 5,000 kept in barbed wire, NO person in this nation should be "caged" without due process of the law. You worry about Nazis free speech, but these kids and their families you think should be "caged"!

As a rule of thumb, if you have a flock of chickens that will be kept housed indoors, they require at least ten square feet per bird. How many square feet should a caged human be allotted?



Japanese American Relocation 1942-1945

Japanese internment camps were established during World War II by President Franklin Roosevelt through his Executive Order 9066. From 1942 to 1945, it was the policy of the U.S. government that people of Japanese descent would be interred in isolated camps. Enacted in reaction to Pearl Harbor and the ensuing war, the Japanese internment camps are now considered one of the most atrocious violations of American civil rights in the 20th century.

At least when we interned the Japanese Americans, we kept the family unit intact. Under Sessions's policy, kids are separated from their parents with the parents themselves being split by sex. Then of course they segregate sibling by sex and age group meaning the entire family unit is broken down. This violates all standards of human rights.

If nothing else, think of the funds required to house all of these people in separate internment camps scattered around the nation. If they want to put them into tent cities as a family unit, it would save redundant costs for housing males and females separate and then separated by age. Children should not be punished for the actions of their parents.



stevelundgren wrote:

Here we go again.
They complain about children in "cages" like animals.
So we move them out of "cages" into tent cities
and now they scream "Nazi concentration camps".
There is no pleasing these tyrants.
Make up your minds!

Intangible wrote:
Echos of 1942...




Those people are zealous to win you over,
but for no good. What they want is to alienate you from us,
so that you may have zeal for them. - Galatians 4:17
Intangible
#28 Posted : Friday, June 15, 2018 8:51:46 PM
Rank: Advanced Member



Joined: 1/4/2010
Posts: 10,646
Location: on a hill in the hollow
Please ask a question. Do not make a false statement about me and then put a question mark at the end. You made a statement that is completely false, but you just have to argue for the sake of arguing, even when the point is crystal clear.

NO CHILDREN should be placed in ANY cage no matter what the size, but more importantly, NO CHILD should EVER be forcefully taken from any family. It is truly sickening to know that any person claiming to be a Christian can support this action of the government.


Exodus 22:21 “Do not mistreat or oppress a foreigner, for you were foreigners in Egypt.

Leviticus 19:33 “‘When a foreigner resides among you in your land, do not mistreat them. 34 The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the Lord your God.

Leviticus 24:22 You are to have the same law for the foreigner and the native-born. I am the Lord your God.’”

Deuteronomy 27:19 “Cursed is anyone who withholds justice from the foreigner, the fatherless or the widow.”

Jeremiah 22:3 This is what the Lord says: Do what is just and right. Rescue from the hand of the oppressor the one who has been robbed. Do no wrong or violence to the foreigner, the fatherless or the widow, and do not shed innocent blood in this place.


Unfortunately, you do not agree with the United Nations or any other signatory of the UN Declaration of Human Rights, but this nation is still legally part of that Declaration. The actions being taken at the command of Jeff Sessions violate even the preamble to the Declaration!

Whereas recognition of the inherent dignity and of the equal and inalienable rights of all members of the human family is the foundation of freedom, justice and peace in the world,

Whereas disregard and contempt for human rights have resulted in barbarous acts which have outraged the conscience of mankind, and the advent of a world in which human beings shall enjoy freedom of speech and belief and freedom from fear and want has been proclaimed as the highest aspiration of the common people,

Whereas it is essential, if man is not to be compelled to have recourse, as a last resort, to rebellion against tyranny and oppression, that human rights should be protected by the rule of law,

Whereas it is essential to promote the development of friendly relations between nations,

Whereas the peoples of the United Nations have in the Charter reaffirmed their faith in fundamental human rights, in the dignity and worth of the human person and in the equal rights of men and women and have determined to promote social progress and better standards of life in larger freedom,

Whereas Member States have pledged themselves to achieve, in co-operation with the United Nations, the promotion of universal respect for and observance of human rights and fundamental freedoms,

Whereas a common understanding of these rights and freedoms is of the greatest importance for the full realization of this pledge,

Now, Therefore THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY proclaims THIS UNIVERSAL DECLARATION OF HUMAN RIGHTS as a common standard of achievement for all peoples and all nations, to the end that every individual and every organ of society, keeping this Declaration constantly in mind, shall strive by teaching and education to promote respect for these rights and freedoms and by progressive measures, national and international, to secure their universal and effective recognition and observance, both among the peoples of Member States themselves and among the peoples of territories under their jurisdiction.





stevelundgren wrote:

So you are claiming that you prefer to leave children in cages?
And you call me pathetic?

Make up your mind.

Without due process of the law?
Are you claiming they are here legally?

Intangible wrote:
You are pathetic! You have actually owned this inhumane treatment of immigrants by claiming "we move them out of "cages" into tent cities". You fully support this action!

Wake up, this is even worse than we did to the Japanese Americans in 1942!

It isn't the size of the "cage" that matters, whether kept ten in a 20 foot cage or 5,000 kept in barbed wire, NO person in this nation should be "caged" without due process of the law. You worry about Nazis free speech, but these kids and their families you think should be "caged"!

As a rule of thumb, if you have a flock of chickens that will be kept housed indoors, they require at least ten square feet per bird. How many square feet should a caged human be allotted?



Japanese American Relocation 1942-1945

Japanese internment camps were established during World War II by President Franklin Roosevelt through his Executive Order 9066. From 1942 to 1945, it was the policy of the U.S. government that people of Japanese descent would be interred in isolated camps. Enacted in reaction to Pearl Harbor and the ensuing war, the Japanese internment camps are now considered one of the most atrocious violations of American civil rights in the 20th century.

At least when we interned the Japanese Americans, we kept the family unit intact. Under Sessions's policy, kids are separated from their parents with the parents themselves being split by sex. Then of course they segregate sibling by sex and age group meaning the entire family unit is broken down. This violates all standards of human rights.

If nothing else, think of the funds required to house all of these people in separate internment camps scattered around the nation. If they want to put them into tent cities as a family unit, it would save redundant costs for housing males and females separate and then separated by age. Children should not be punished for the actions of their parents.




The difference between patriotism and nationalism is that the patriot is proud of his country for what it does, and the nationalist is proud of his country no matter what it does; the first attitude creates a feeling of responsibility, but the second a feeling of blind arrogance that leads to war.
Sydney J. Harris
stevelundgren
#29 Posted : Friday, June 15, 2018 9:20:57 PM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 3/3/2008
Posts: 27,825

Perhaps you would prefer that they be deported then?
Their country of origin would no doubt treat them better than we are. Right?

It would be hard to imagine that they fled due to unfavorable conditions. Correct?
I mean, it's not like we are keeping them safe and alive being here. Nope, "cruelty".
Send them home then. That will make everyone happier. Yes?

Intangible wrote:
Please ask a question. Do not make a false statement about me and then put a question mark at the end. You made a statement that is completely false, but you just have to argue for the sake of arguing, even when the point is crystal clear.

NO CHILDREN should be placed in ANY cage no matter what the size, but more importantly, NO CHILD should EVER be forcefully taken from any family. It is truly sickening to know that any person claiming to be a Christian can support this action of the government.


Exodus 22:21 “Do not mistreat or oppress a foreigner, for you were foreigners in Egypt.

Leviticus 19:33 “‘When a foreigner resides among you in your land, do not mistreat them. 34 The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the Lord your God.

Leviticus 24:22 You are to have the same law for the foreigner and the native-born. I am the Lord your God.’”

Deuteronomy 27:19 “Cursed is anyone who withholds justice from the foreigner, the fatherless or the widow.”

Jeremiah 22:3 This is what the Lord says: Do what is just and right. Rescue from the hand of the oppressor the one who has been robbed. Do no wrong or violence to the foreigner, the fatherless or the widow, and do not shed innocent blood in this place.


Unfortunately, you do not agree with the United Nations or any other signatory of the UN Declaration of Human Rights, but this nation is still legally part of that Declaration. The actions being taken at the command of Jeff Sessions violate even the preamble to the Declaration!

Whereas recognition of the inherent dignity and of the equal and inalienable rights of all members of the human family is the foundation of freedom, justice and peace in the world,

Whereas disregard and contempt for human rights have resulted in barbarous acts which have outraged the conscience of mankind, and the advent of a world in which human beings shall enjoy freedom of speech and belief and freedom from fear and want has been proclaimed as the highest aspiration of the common people,

Whereas it is essential, if man is not to be compelled to have recourse, as a last resort, to rebellion against tyranny and oppression, that human rights should be protected by the rule of law,

Whereas it is essential to promote the development of friendly relations between nations,

Whereas the peoples of the United Nations have in the Charter reaffirmed their faith in fundamental human rights, in the dignity and worth of the human person and in the equal rights of men and women and have determined to promote social progress and better standards of life in larger freedom,

Whereas Member States have pledged themselves to achieve, in co-operation with the United Nations, the promotion of universal respect for and observance of human rights and fundamental freedoms,

Whereas a common understanding of these rights and freedoms is of the greatest importance for the full realization of this pledge,

Now, Therefore THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY proclaims THIS UNIVERSAL DECLARATION OF HUMAN RIGHTS as a common standard of achievement for all peoples and all nations, to the end that every individual and every organ of society, keeping this Declaration constantly in mind, shall strive by teaching and education to promote respect for these rights and freedoms and by progressive measures, national and international, to secure their universal and effective recognition and observance, both among the peoples of Member States themselves and among the peoples of territories under their jurisdiction.





stevelundgren wrote:

So you are claiming that you prefer to leave children in cages?
And you call me pathetic?

Make up your mind.

Without due process of the law?
Are you claiming they are here legally?

Intangible wrote:
You are pathetic! You have actually owned this inhumane treatment of immigrants by claiming "we move them out of "cages" into tent cities". You fully support this action!

Wake up, this is even worse than we did to the Japanese Americans in 1942!

It isn't the size of the "cage" that matters, whether kept ten in a 20 foot cage or 5,000 kept in barbed wire, NO person in this nation should be "caged" without due process of the law. You worry about Nazis free speech, but these kids and their families you think should be "caged"!

As a rule of thumb, if you have a flock of chickens that will be kept housed indoors, they require at least ten square feet per bird. How many square feet should a caged human be allotted?



Japanese American Relocation 1942-1945

Japanese internment camps were established during World War II by President Franklin Roosevelt through his Executive Order 9066. From 1942 to 1945, it was the policy of the U.S. government that people of Japanese descent would be interred in isolated camps. Enacted in reaction to Pearl Harbor and the ensuing war, the Japanese internment camps are now considered one of the most atrocious violations of American civil rights in the 20th century.

At least when we interned the Japanese Americans, we kept the family unit intact. Under Sessions's policy, kids are separated from their parents with the parents themselves being split by sex. Then of course they segregate sibling by sex and age group meaning the entire family unit is broken down. This violates all standards of human rights.

If nothing else, think of the funds required to house all of these people in separate internment camps scattered around the nation. If they want to put them into tent cities as a family unit, it would save redundant costs for housing males and females separate and then separated by age. Children should not be punished for the actions of their parents.





Those people are zealous to win you over,
but for no good. What they want is to alienate you from us,
so that you may have zeal for them. - Galatians 4:17
Intangible
#30 Posted : Saturday, June 16, 2018 8:09:01 PM
Rank: Advanced Member



Joined: 1/4/2010
Posts: 10,646
Location: on a hill in the hollow
Oh, they are getting "helped"? As you said, they are fleeing deplorable living conditions and seeking safety and refuge in the United States of America. So, do you think, in order to provide as much assistance as possible, they first separate parents and jail them? Are they helping these children through the obvious traumatic experience when they take all of them and divide them up according to ages and sex, after which they intern them all separately until their parents are convicted and deported? Is this the type of "Christian" nation's actions that YOU support?!

In reality, they separate and imprison individual family members UNTIL they get deported, so their is NO help involved. It is state sponsored terrorism that many evangelical American Christians support!

You know when they started rounding up the Jews, they said they were helping them. Nazis separated family members according to their ability to be used as a slave.... anyone not worthy was executed rather than worked to death. This too happened under the watchful and approving eye of the Nazi German "Christians"..... history repeats itself and American evangelical Christians are just as guilty as the Nazi Christians.

I'm done, you want nothing but to argue your absurd fantasies.



stevelundgren wrote:

Perhaps you would prefer that they be deported then?
Their country of origin would no doubt treat them better than we are. Right?

It would be hard to imagine that they fled due to unfavorable conditions. Correct?
I mean, it's not like we are keeping them safe and alive being here. Nope, "cruelty".
Send them home then. That will make everyone happier. Yes?

Intangible wrote:
Please ask a question. Do not make a false statement about me and then put a question mark at the end. You made a statement that is completely false, but you just have to argue for the sake of arguing, even when the point is crystal clear.

NO CHILDREN should be placed in ANY cage no matter what the size, but more importantly, NO CHILD should EVER be forcefully taken from any family. It is truly sickening to know that any person claiming to be a Christian can support this action of the government.


Exodus 22:21 “Do not mistreat or oppress a foreigner, for you were foreigners in Egypt.

Leviticus 19:33 “‘When a foreigner resides among you in your land, do not mistreat them. 34 The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the Lord your God.

Leviticus 24:22 You are to have the same law for the foreigner and the native-born. I am the Lord your God.’”

Deuteronomy 27:19 “Cursed is anyone who withholds justice from the foreigner, the fatherless or the widow.”

Jeremiah 22:3 This is what the Lord says: Do what is just and right. Rescue from the hand of the oppressor the one who has been robbed. Do no wrong or violence to the foreigner, the fatherless or the widow, and do not shed innocent blood in this place.


Unfortunately, you do not agree with the United Nations or any other signatory of the UN Declaration of Human Rights, but this nation is still legally part of that Declaration. The actions being taken at the command of Jeff Sessions violate even the preamble to the Declaration!

Whereas recognition of the inherent dignity and of the equal and inalienable rights of all members of the human family is the foundation of freedom, justice and peace in the world,

Whereas disregard and contempt for human rights have resulted in barbarous acts which have outraged the conscience of mankind, and the advent of a world in which human beings shall enjoy freedom of speech and belief and freedom from fear and want has been proclaimed as the highest aspiration of the common people,

Whereas it is essential, if man is not to be compelled to have recourse, as a last resort, to rebellion against tyranny and oppression, that human rights should be protected by the rule of law,

Whereas it is essential to promote the development of friendly relations between nations,

Whereas the peoples of the United Nations have in the Charter reaffirmed their faith in fundamental human rights, in the dignity and worth of the human person and in the equal rights of men and women and have determined to promote social progress and better standards of life in larger freedom,

Whereas Member States have pledged themselves to achieve, in co-operation with the United Nations, the promotion of universal respect for and observance of human rights and fundamental freedoms,

Whereas a common understanding of these rights and freedoms is of the greatest importance for the full realization of this pledge,

Now, Therefore THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY proclaims THIS UNIVERSAL DECLARATION OF HUMAN RIGHTS as a common standard of achievement for all peoples and all nations, to the end that every individual and every organ of society, keeping this Declaration constantly in mind, shall strive by teaching and education to promote respect for these rights and freedoms and by progressive measures, national and international, to secure their universal and effective recognition and observance, both among the peoples of Member States themselves and among the peoples of territories under their jurisdiction.





stevelundgren wrote:

So you are claiming that you prefer to leave children in cages?
And you call me pathetic?

Make up your mind.

Without due process of the law?
Are you claiming they are here legally?

Intangible wrote:
You are pathetic! You have actually owned this inhumane treatment of immigrants by claiming "we move them out of "cages" into tent cities". You fully support this action!

Wake up, this is even worse than we did to the Japanese Americans in 1942!

It isn't the size of the "cage" that matters, whether kept ten in a 20 foot cage or 5,000 kept in barbed wire, NO person in this nation should be "caged" without due process of the law. You worry about Nazis free speech, but these kids and their families you think should be "caged"!

As a rule of thumb, if you have a flock of chickens that will be kept housed indoors, they require at least ten square feet per bird. How many square feet should a caged human be allotted?



Japanese American Relocation 1942-1945

Japanese internment camps were established during World War II by President Franklin Roosevelt through his Executive Order 9066. From 1942 to 1945, it was the policy of the U.S. government that people of Japanese descent would be interred in isolated camps. Enacted in reaction to Pearl Harbor and the ensuing war, the Japanese internment camps are now considered one of the most atrocious violations of American civil rights in the 20th century.

At least when we interned the Japanese Americans, we kept the family unit intact. Under Sessions's policy, kids are separated from their parents with the parents themselves being split by sex. Then of course they segregate sibling by sex and age group meaning the entire family unit is broken down. This violates all standards of human rights.

If nothing else, think of the funds required to house all of these people in separate internment camps scattered around the nation. If they want to put them into tent cities as a family unit, it would save redundant costs for housing males and females separate and then separated by age. Children should not be punished for the actions of their parents.






The difference between patriotism and nationalism is that the patriot is proud of his country for what it does, and the nationalist is proud of his country no matter what it does; the first attitude creates a feeling of responsibility, but the second a feeling of blind arrogance that leads to war.
Sydney J. Harris
stevelundgren
#31 Posted : Saturday, June 16, 2018 10:03:57 PM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 3/3/2008
Posts: 27,825

If they entered illegally, why wouldn't you expect them to be treated like criminals?

Intangible wrote:
Oh, they are getting "helped"? As you said, they are fleeing deplorable living conditions and seeking safety and refuge in the United States of America. So, do you think, in order to provide as much assistance as possible, they first separate parents and jail them? Are they helping these children through the obvious traumatic experience when they take all of them and divide them up according to ages and sex, after which they intern them all separately until their parents are convicted and deported? Is this the type of "Christian" nation's actions that YOU support?!

In reality, they separate and imprison individual family members UNTIL they get deported, so their is NO help involved. It is state sponsored terrorism that many evangelical American Christians support!

You know when they started rounding up the Jews, they said they were helping them. Nazis separated family members according to their ability to be used as a slave.... anyone not worthy was executed rather than worked to death. This too happened under the watchful and approving eye of the Nazi German "Christians"..... history repeats itself and American evangelical Christians are just as guilty as the Nazi Christians.

I'm done, you want nothing but to argue your absurd fantasies.



stevelundgren wrote:

Perhaps you would prefer that they be deported then?
Their country of origin would no doubt treat them better than we are. Right?

It would be hard to imagine that they fled due to unfavorable conditions. Correct?
I mean, it's not like we are keeping them safe and alive being here. Nope, "cruelty".
Send them home then. That will make everyone happier. Yes?

Intangible wrote:
Please ask a question. Do not make a false statement about me and then put a question mark at the end. You made a statement that is completely false, but you just have to argue for the sake of arguing, even when the point is crystal clear.

NO CHILDREN should be placed in ANY cage no matter what the size, but more importantly, NO CHILD should EVER be forcefully taken from any family. It is truly sickening to know that any person claiming to be a Christian can support this action of the government.


Exodus 22:21 “Do not mistreat or oppress a foreigner, for you were foreigners in Egypt.

Leviticus 19:33 “‘When a foreigner resides among you in your land, do not mistreat them. 34 The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the Lord your God.

Leviticus 24:22 You are to have the same law for the foreigner and the native-born. I am the Lord your God.’”

Deuteronomy 27:19 “Cursed is anyone who withholds justice from the foreigner, the fatherless or the widow.”

Jeremiah 22:3 This is what the Lord says: Do what is just and right. Rescue from the hand of the oppressor the one who has been robbed. Do no wrong or violence to the foreigner, the fatherless or the widow, and do not shed innocent blood in this place.


Unfortunately, you do not agree with the United Nations or any other signatory of the UN Declaration of Human Rights, but this nation is still legally part of that Declaration. The actions being taken at the command of Jeff Sessions violate even the preamble to the Declaration!

Whereas recognition of the inherent dignity and of the equal and inalienable rights of all members of the human family is the foundation of freedom, justice and peace in the world,

Whereas disregard and contempt for human rights have resulted in barbarous acts which have outraged the conscience of mankind, and the advent of a world in which human beings shall enjoy freedom of speech and belief and freedom from fear and want has been proclaimed as the highest aspiration of the common people,

Whereas it is essential, if man is not to be compelled to have recourse, as a last resort, to rebellion against tyranny and oppression, that human rights should be protected by the rule of law,

Whereas it is essential to promote the development of friendly relations between nations,

Whereas the peoples of the United Nations have in the Charter reaffirmed their faith in fundamental human rights, in the dignity and worth of the human person and in the equal rights of men and women and have determined to promote social progress and better standards of life in larger freedom,

Whereas Member States have pledged themselves to achieve, in co-operation with the United Nations, the promotion of universal respect for and observance of human rights and fundamental freedoms,

Whereas a common understanding of these rights and freedoms is of the greatest importance for the full realization of this pledge,

Now, Therefore THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY proclaims THIS UNIVERSAL DECLARATION OF HUMAN RIGHTS as a common standard of achievement for all peoples and all nations, to the end that every individual and every organ of society, keeping this Declaration constantly in mind, shall strive by teaching and education to promote respect for these rights and freedoms and by progressive measures, national and international, to secure their universal and effective recognition and observance, both among the peoples of Member States themselves and among the peoples of territories under their jurisdiction.





stevelundgren wrote:

So you are claiming that you prefer to leave children in cages?
And you call me pathetic?

Make up your mind.

Without due process of the law?
Are you claiming they are here legally?

Intangible wrote:
You are pathetic! You have actually owned this inhumane treatment of immigrants by claiming "we move them out of "cages" into tent cities". You fully support this action!

Wake up, this is even worse than we did to the Japanese Americans in 1942!

It isn't the size of the "cage" that matters, whether kept ten in a 20 foot cage or 5,000 kept in barbed wire, NO person in this nation should be "caged" without due process of the law. You worry about Nazis free speech, but these kids and their families you think should be "caged"!

As a rule of thumb, if you have a flock of chickens that will be kept housed indoors, they require at least ten square feet per bird. How many square feet should a caged human be allotted?



Japanese American Relocation 1942-1945

Japanese internment camps were established during World War II by President Franklin Roosevelt through his Executive Order 9066. From 1942 to 1945, it was the policy of the U.S. government that people of Japanese descent would be interred in isolated camps. Enacted in reaction to Pearl Harbor and the ensuing war, the Japanese internment camps are now considered one of the most atrocious violations of American civil rights in the 20th century.

At least when we interned the Japanese Americans, we kept the family unit intact. Under Sessions's policy, kids are separated from their parents with the parents themselves being split by sex. Then of course they segregate sibling by sex and age group meaning the entire family unit is broken down. This violates all standards of human rights.

If nothing else, think of the funds required to house all of these people in separate internment camps scattered around the nation. If they want to put them into tent cities as a family unit, it would save redundant costs for housing males and females separate and then separated by age. Children should not be punished for the actions of their parents.







Those people are zealous to win you over,
but for no good. What they want is to alienate you from us,
so that you may have zeal for them. - Galatians 4:17
Intangible
#32 Posted : Tuesday, June 19, 2018 10:38:15 PM
Rank: Advanced Member



Joined: 1/4/2010
Posts: 10,646
Location: on a hill in the hollow
Herr Drumph is remaking his homeland in the United States and the right wingnuts think he's doing a great job.

The difference between patriotism and nationalism is that the patriot is proud of his country for what it does, and the nationalist is proud of his country no matter what it does; the first attitude creates a feeling of responsibility, but the second a feeling of blind arrogance that leads to war.
Sydney J. Harris
stevelundgren
#33 Posted : Wednesday, June 20, 2018 6:40:30 AM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 3/3/2008
Posts: 27,825

Trump is right.
All you care about is importing voters.

If you were imprisoned in the USA, would you expect
to be separated from your family?

Intangible wrote:
Herr Drumph is remaking his homeland in the United States and the right wingnuts think he's doing a great job.


Those people are zealous to win you over,
but for no good. What they want is to alienate you from us,
so that you may have zeal for them. - Galatians 4:17
Intangible
#34 Posted : Wednesday, June 20, 2018 6:30:00 PM
Rank: Advanced Member



Joined: 1/4/2010
Posts: 10,646
Location: on a hill in the hollow
stevelundgren wrote:
Trump is right.
All you care about is importing voters.


That is the most ludicrous charge you have ever made against me!


stevelundgren wrote:
If you were imprisoned in the USA, would you expect
to be separated from your family?


If I were to be charged with a crime, I would be processed, indicted and tried BEFORE I was ever sent to prison. If I were to be found guilty and sentenced to prison, NOTHING would happen to my family unless there was no spouse or other family to care for minor children. This is a fundamental right guaranteed by the United States Constitution. This is also a basic human right under the UN Declaration of Human Rights, of which this nation has signed.

Listed below are just a few of the basic human rights written into the UN Declaration of Human Rights that apply to ALL people.



Article 1.

All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights. They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.

Article 2.

Everyone is entitled to all the rights and freedoms set forth in this Declaration, without distinction of any kind, such as race, colour, sex, language, religion, political or other opinion, national or social origin, property, birth or other status. Furthermore, no distinction shall be made on the basis of the political, jurisdictional or international status of the country or territory to which a person belongs, whether it be independent, trust, non-self-governing or under any other limitation of sovereignty.

Article 5.

No one shall be subjected to torture or to cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment.

Article 6.

Everyone has the right to recognition everywhere as a person before the law.

Article 7.

All are equal before the law and are entitled without any discrimination to equal protection of the law. All are entitled to equal protection against any discrimination in violation of this Declaration and against any incitement to such discrimination.

Article 8.

Everyone has the right to an effective remedy by the competent national tribunals for acts violating the fundamental rights granted him by the constitution or by law.

Article 9.

No one shall be subjected to arbitrary arrest, detention or exile.

Article 10.

Everyone is entitled in full equality to a fair and public hearing by an independent and impartial tribunal, in the determination of his rights and obligations and of any criminal charge against him.

Article 11.

(1) Everyone charged with a penal offence has the right to be presumed innocent until proved guilty according to law in a public trial at which he has had all the guarantees necessary for his defence.
(2) No one shall be held guilty of any penal offence on account of any act or omission which did not constitute a penal offence, under national or international law, at the time when it was committed. Nor shall a heavier penalty be imposed than the one that was applicable at the time the penal offence was committed.

Article 12.

No one shall be subjected to arbitrary interference with his privacy, family, home or correspondence, nor to attacks upon his honour and reputation. Everyone has the right to the protection of the law against such interference or attacks.

Article 14.

(1) Everyone has the right to seek and to enjoy in other countries asylum from persecution.
(2) This right may not be invoked in the case of prosecutions genuinely arising from non-political crimes or from acts contrary to the purposes and principles of the United Nations.





Intangible wrote:
Herr Drumph is remaking his homeland in the United States and the right wingnuts think he's doing a great job.


[/quote]
The difference between patriotism and nationalism is that the patriot is proud of his country for what it does, and the nationalist is proud of his country no matter what it does; the first attitude creates a feeling of responsibility, but the second a feeling of blind arrogance that leads to war.
Sydney J. Harris
stevelundgren
#35 Posted : Wednesday, June 20, 2018 9:11:09 PM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 3/3/2008
Posts: 27,825

Are you claiming free food, housing and healthcare for those in prison?
Democracy in action.

Intangible wrote:
stevelundgren wrote:
Trump is right.
All you care about is importing voters.


That is the most ludicrous charge you have ever made against me!


stevelundgren wrote:
If you were imprisoned in the USA, would you expect
to be separated from your family?


If I were to be charged with a crime, I would be processed, indicted and tried BEFORE I was ever sent to prison. If I were to be found guilty and sentenced to prison, NOTHING would happen to my family unless there was no spouse or other family to care for minor children. This is a fundamental right guaranteed by the United States Constitution. This is also a basic human right under the UN Declaration of Human Rights, of which this nation has signed.

Listed below are just a few of the basic human rights written into the UN Declaration of Human Rights that apply to ALL people.



Article 1.

All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights. They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.

Article 2.

Everyone is entitled to all the rights and freedoms set forth in this Declaration, without distinction of any kind, such as race, colour, sex, language, religion, political or other opinion, national or social origin, property, birth or other status. Furthermore, no distinction shall be made on the basis of the political, jurisdictional or international status of the country or territory to which a person belongs, whether it be independent, trust, non-self-governing or under any other limitation of sovereignty.

Article 5.

No one shall be subjected to torture or to cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment.

Article 6.

Everyone has the right to recognition everywhere as a person before the law.

Article 7.

All are equal before the law and are entitled without any discrimination to equal protection of the law. All are entitled to equal protection against any discrimination in violation of this Declaration and against any incitement to such discrimination.

Article 8.

Everyone has the right to an effective remedy by the competent national tribunals for acts violating the fundamental rights granted him by the constitution or by law.

Article 9.

No one shall be subjected to arbitrary arrest, detention or exile.

Article 10.

Everyone is entitled in full equality to a fair and public hearing by an independent and impartial tribunal, in the determination of his rights and obligations and of any criminal charge against him.

Article 11.

(1) Everyone charged with a penal offence has the right to be presumed innocent until proved guilty according to law in a public trial at which he has had all the guarantees necessary for his defence.
(2) No one shall be held guilty of any penal offence on account of any act or omission which did not constitute a penal offence, under national or international law, at the time when it was committed. Nor shall a heavier penalty be imposed than the one that was applicable at the time the penal offence was committed.

Article 12.

No one shall be subjected to arbitrary interference with his privacy, family, home or correspondence, nor to attacks upon his honour and reputation. Everyone has the right to the protection of the law against such interference or attacks.

Article 14.

(1) Everyone has the right to seek and to enjoy in other countries asylum from persecution.
(2) This right may not be invoked in the case of prosecutions genuinely arising from non-political crimes or from acts contrary to the purposes and principles of the United Nations.





Intangible wrote:
Herr Drumph is remaking his homeland in the United States and the right wingnuts think he's doing a great job.



[/quote]
Those people are zealous to win you over,
but for no good. What they want is to alienate you from us,
so that you may have zeal for them. - Galatians 4:17
Intangible
#36 Posted : Wednesday, June 20, 2018 11:45:17 PM
Rank: Advanced Member



Joined: 1/4/2010
Posts: 10,646
Location: on a hill in the hollow
I know you just want to argue, but what has feeding inmates got to do with the situation? I NEVER said anything is free, particularly keeping people in prison. It can cost from $30,000 to $70,000 a year to house and feed an inmate..... nothing is free.


stevelundgren wrote:

Are you claiming free food, housing and healthcare for those in prison?
Democracy in action.

Intangible wrote:
stevelundgren wrote:
Trump is right.
All you care about is importing voters.


That is the most ludicrous charge you have ever made against me!


stevelundgren wrote:
If you were imprisoned in the USA, would you expect
to be separated from your family?


If I were to be charged with a crime, I would be processed, indicted and tried BEFORE I was ever sent to prison. If I were to be found guilty and sentenced to prison, NOTHING would happen to my family unless there was no spouse or other family to care for minor children. This is a fundamental right guaranteed by the United States Constitution. This is also a basic human right under the UN Declaration of Human Rights, of which this nation has signed.

Listed below are just a few of the basic human rights written into the UN Declaration of Human Rights that apply to ALL people.



Article 1.

All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights. They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.

Article 2.

Everyone is entitled to all the rights and freedoms set forth in this Declaration, without distinction of any kind, such as race, colour, sex, language, religion, political or other opinion, national or social origin, property, birth or other status. Furthermore, no distinction shall be made on the basis of the political, jurisdictional or international status of the country or territory to which a person belongs, whether it be independent, trust, non-self-governing or under any other limitation of sovereignty.

Article 5.

No one shall be subjected to torture or to cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment.

Article 6.

Everyone has the right to recognition everywhere as a person before the law.

Article 7.

All are equal before the law and are entitled without any discrimination to equal protection of the law. All are entitled to equal protection against any discrimination in violation of this Declaration and against any incitement to such discrimination.

Article 8.

Everyone has the right to an effective remedy by the competent national tribunals for acts violating the fundamental rights granted him by the constitution or by law.

Article 9.

No one shall be subjected to arbitrary arrest, detention or exile.

Article 10.

Everyone is entitled in full equality to a fair and public hearing by an independent and impartial tribunal, in the determination of his rights and obligations and of any criminal charge against him.

Article 11.

(1) Everyone charged with a penal offence has the right to be presumed innocent until proved guilty according to law in a public trial at which he has had all the guarantees necessary for his defence.
(2) No one shall be held guilty of any penal offence on account of any act or omission which did not constitute a penal offence, under national or international law, at the time when it was committed. Nor shall a heavier penalty be imposed than the one that was applicable at the time the penal offence was committed.

Article 12.

No one shall be subjected to arbitrary interference with his privacy, family, home or correspondence, nor to attacks upon his honour and reputation. Everyone has the right to the protection of the law against such interference or attacks.

Article 14.

(1) Everyone has the right to seek and to enjoy in other countries asylum from persecution.
(2) This right may not be invoked in the case of prosecutions genuinely arising from non-political crimes or from acts contrary to the purposes and principles of the United Nations.





Intangible wrote:
Herr Drumph is remaking his homeland in the United States and the right wingnuts think he's doing a great job.




[/quote]
The difference between patriotism and nationalism is that the patriot is proud of his country for what it does, and the nationalist is proud of his country no matter what it does; the first attitude creates a feeling of responsibility, but the second a feeling of blind arrogance that leads to war.
Sydney J. Harris
stevelundgren
#37 Posted : Thursday, June 21, 2018 6:54:30 AM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 3/3/2008
Posts: 27,825

It is not unlawful detainment to arrest a lawbreaker.
Including their accomplice "families".


Intangible wrote:
I know you just want to argue, but what has feeding inmates got to do with the situation? I NEVER said anything is free, particularly keeping people in prison. It can cost from $30,000 to $70,000 a year to house and feed an inmate..... nothing is free.


stevelundgren wrote:

Are you claiming free food, housing and healthcare for those in prison?
Democracy in action.

Intangible wrote:
stevelundgren wrote:
Trump is right.
All you care about is importing voters.


That is the most ludicrous charge you have ever made against me!


stevelundgren wrote:
If you were imprisoned in the USA, would you expect
to be separated from your family?


If I were to be charged with a crime, I would be processed, indicted and tried BEFORE I was ever sent to prison. If I were to be found guilty and sentenced to prison, NOTHING would happen to my family unless there was no spouse or other family to care for minor children. This is a fundamental right guaranteed by the United States Constitution. This is also a basic human right under the UN Declaration of Human Rights, of which this nation has signed.

Listed below are just a few of the basic human rights written into the UN Declaration of Human Rights that apply to ALL people.



Article 1.

All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights. They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.

Article 2.

Everyone is entitled to all the rights and freedoms set forth in this Declaration, without distinction of any kind, such as race, colour, sex, language, religion, political or other opinion, national or social origin, property, birth or other status. Furthermore, no distinction shall be made on the basis of the political, jurisdictional or international status of the country or territory to which a person belongs, whether it be independent, trust, non-self-governing or under any other limitation of sovereignty.

Article 5.

No one shall be subjected to torture or to cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment.

Article 6.

Everyone has the right to recognition everywhere as a person before the law.

Article 7.

All are equal before the law and are entitled without any discrimination to equal protection of the law. All are entitled to equal protection against any discrimination in violation of this Declaration and against any incitement to such discrimination.

Article 8.

Everyone has the right to an effective remedy by the competent national tribunals for acts violating the fundamental rights granted him by the constitution or by law.

Article 9.

No one shall be subjected to arbitrary arrest, detention or exile.

Article 10.

Everyone is entitled in full equality to a fair and public hearing by an independent and impartial tribunal, in the determination of his rights and obligations and of any criminal charge against him.

Article 11.

(1) Everyone charged with a penal offence has the right to be presumed innocent until proved guilty according to law in a public trial at which he has had all the guarantees necessary for his defence.
(2) No one shall be held guilty of any penal offence on account of any act or omission which did not constitute a penal offence, under national or international law, at the time when it was committed. Nor shall a heavier penalty be imposed than the one that was applicable at the time the penal offence was committed.

Article 12.

No one shall be subjected to arbitrary interference with his privacy, family, home or correspondence, nor to attacks upon his honour and reputation. Everyone has the right to the protection of the law against such interference or attacks.

Article 14.

(1) Everyone has the right to seek and to enjoy in other countries asylum from persecution.
(2) This right may not be invoked in the case of prosecutions genuinely arising from non-political crimes or from acts contrary to the purposes and principles of the United Nations.





Intangible wrote:
Herr Drumph is remaking his homeland in the United States and the right wingnuts think he's doing a great job.





[/quote]
Those people are zealous to win you over,
but for no good. What they want is to alienate you from us,
so that you may have zeal for them. - Galatians 4:17
Intangible
#38 Posted : Thursday, June 21, 2018 8:14:14 PM
Rank: Advanced Member



Joined: 1/4/2010
Posts: 10,646
Location: on a hill in the hollow
The first step of fascism is to demonize the media, to convince followers that they cannot trust anything they hear or read..... only THEY will tell you the truth. After demonizing the media the focus shifts to pointing a finger at people to blame for all the nation's problems. The people coalesce when they can have a common enemy.

The difference between patriotism and nationalism is that the patriot is proud of his country for what it does, and the nationalist is proud of his country no matter what it does; the first attitude creates a feeling of responsibility, but the second a feeling of blind arrogance that leads to war.
Sydney J. Harris
Intangible
#39 Posted : Friday, June 22, 2018 6:59:35 PM
Rank: Advanced Member



Joined: 1/4/2010
Posts: 10,646
Location: on a hill in the hollow
A lot of people read in bed and keep a book on the nightstand, quite a few have the Holy Bible on their nightstand..... Trump keeps a book of Adolph Hitler's speeches on his nightstand. No wonder his rallies look and sound so much like Hitler's.

The difference between patriotism and nationalism is that the patriot is proud of his country for what it does, and the nationalist is proud of his country no matter what it does; the first attitude creates a feeling of responsibility, but the second a feeling of blind arrogance that leads to war.
Sydney J. Harris
stevelundgren
#40 Posted : Friday, June 22, 2018 7:27:26 PM
Rank: Advanced Member




Joined: 3/3/2008
Posts: 27,825

You can't be serious.
You actually believe that????????????
RollEyes RollEyes Laugh Laugh Laugh Razz Razz Scared Scared Scared

Intangible wrote:
A lot of people read in bed and keep a book on the nightstand, quite a few have the Holy Bible on their nightstand..... Trump keeps a book of Adolph Hitler's speeches on his nightstand. No wonder his rallies look and sound so much like Hitler's.


Those people are zealous to win you over,
but for no good. What they want is to alienate you from us,
so that you may have zeal for them. - Galatians 4:17
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